Catherine Tindall 0:00
If you have that level of complexity where you’re getting heavily involved in investing in real estate investing, specifically, the tax ramifications are so important as part of being able to really get the best out of your investments. That by having that proactive relationship, you’re really going to be able to get a lot more out of your tax professional and it’ll turn quickly from it being an expense to you to it being something that is going to you know, generate more, you know, wealth for you because you’re taking advantage of everything you’re eligible for.
Welcome to CRE PN Radio for influential commercial real estate professionals who work with investors, buyers and sellers of commercial real estate coast to coast whether you are an investor, broker, lender, property manager, attorney or accountant we are here to learn from the experts.
J Darrin Gross 0:53
Welcome to Commercial Real Estate Pro Networks, CRE PN Radio. Thanks for joining us. My name is J. Darrin Gross. This is the podcast focused on commercial real estate investment and risk management strategies. Weekly, we have a conversation with commercial real estate investors and professionals who provide your experience and insight to help you grow your real estate portfolio.
Today, my guest is Catherine Tindall. She is a CPA and partner at Dominion Enterprise Services, a concierge tax advisory practice. And in just a minute, we’re going to speak with Catherine, how to get the most out of your CPA relationship, and some general tax planning strategies for real estate investors.
But first, a quick reminder, if you like our show, CRE PN Radio, there are a couple things you can do to help us out. You can like, share and subscribe. And as always, we encourage you to leave a comment, we’d love to hear from our listeners. Also, if you’d like to see how attractive Our guests are, be sure to check out our YouTube channel. And you can find us on YouTube at commercial real estate pro network. And while you’re there, please subscribe. With that, I want to welcome my guest, Catherine Welcome to CRE PN Radio.
Catherine Tindall 2:13
Thank you so much for having me, Darrin,
J Darrin Gross 2:15
I’m looking forward to our conversation. But before we get started, if you could take just a minute and share with the listeners a little bit about your background.
Catherine Tindall 2:23
Yeah, so I’m a CPA, I’m my practice is located in Greater Boston, but we serve clients all over the country, the firm’s called Dominion Enterprise Services, we work with real estate investors, real estate professionals, self employed individuals, people who own businesses, because the primary focus that our practice has is tax planning work. So we work proactively with clients, where we know we’re going to be a profit center for them by generating creative out of the box tax strategies that are able to, you know, have five to six figures of impact for our clients. So that’s, that’s a bit of our our background.
J Darrin Gross 3:02
No, got it. That’s perfect. And so speaking to to the, like a real estate investor, or a real estate professional, what are some, I guess, kind of some good guidelines that you can suggest as far as identifying or picking a CPA that that can best serve real estate professional or real estate investors needs?
Catherine Tindall 3:31
Yeah, so it’s a common problem that I see real estate professionals and investors have is that the relationship that they have with their current professional is not what it should be for what they need. And I think for a lot of people, they don’t take a step back and think, you know, when taxes wiping out 20 to 50% of your income, that relationship of managing that really big expenses, it’s important to have that be strategic, and have that really be working for you. And so I think the best piece of advice that I can give for people when they’re looking out for a tax professional is because we’re so technical CPAs it’s hard to judge the quality unless you also know a lot technically about what goes on in tax. But I think for people having more of the mindset in those relationships of you know, is this professional, someone who’s just trying to get my tax return done, just trying to keep me compliant with a filing requirement? Am I you know, one of hundreds of clients that this person this individual person is serving, or is this person more an advisor, and that’s how they position themselves and that’s how they position what their services that they’re interested in doing more. They’re interested in being proactive. Because I think more than anything, it’s if you have that level of complexity where you’re getting heavily involved in investing in real estate investing specifically See, the tax ramifications are so important, as part of being able to really get the best out of your investments, that by having that proactive relationship, you’re really going to be able to get a lot more out of your tax professional. And it’ll turn quickly from it being an expense to you to it being something that is going to, you know, generate more, you know, wealth for you, because you’re taking advantage of everything you’re eligible for, which for real estate, anyone involved in real estate, there’s just a lot available in the tax code to be taken advantage of.
J Darrin Gross 5:35
Yeah, no, I mean, that’s one of the the great appeals of real estate as the tax treatment. So when you mentioned kind of, are you just a report, they’ve got to get done to get filed by a deadline? My words, not yours, but versus an advisor? From an advisor standpoint, I’m assuming, is that kind of where you guys try? And is that where your practice is focused on more of the advisory role?
Catherine Tindall 6:05
Yeah, so we’ve really shifted, when I originally founded this firm, a couple years ago, after working in other CPA firms, I realized that there was just in a lot of the client relationships, there were a lot of things that were broken, and that there were so much money being left on the table by the clients just because of the nature of the relationship. And so part of what pushed me to have the firm have more of this proactive advisory focus was so that people could really take advantage of all of the things that we knew how to do and how to really strategize things, because I think for a lot of people that I’ve encountered who come to me from other tax professionals, you know, they’re not even aware sometimes of things like doing Cost Segregation studies, or, you know, once when’s the strategic time to do a 1031 exchange, or, you know, even for people that are more in like, the fix and flip area, you know, can you take advantage of the personal residence exclusion, you know, if you want to live in a property and then upgrade, you know, they’re just not even aware of a lot of the basic strategies that are involved around real estate. Because they don’t have, you know, they haven’t just had they haven’t had that kind of relationship with a tax professional.
J Darrin Gross 7:19
Yeah, no, I’m, you know, sign me up as having had those conversations and realizations. I, I, we have some investment properties. And I remember mentioning to my, my former CPA, about cost segregation study, and, and, you know, it, he was basically like, well, you can do it, but, you know, you’re not a real estate professional, you won’t be able to take advantage of any additional in a write off, and as basically, you know, just kind of left at that. And, and, but then as we acquired another property of new CPA and, and ran into a tax situation that was going to be punitive, and I was like, Holy crap, what about what about this? And I, I don’t know that he’d ever done one before. But he was open to it. And we did get a, a cost segregation study done. And I was like, that’s a huge, that’s a huge thing. I mean, I just got, I can’t believe all the people that may know the word. But, you know, professionals like yourself that aren’t really attuned to it to really know the benefits of something. Yeah. That it’s, it’s just a huge, no, yeah. Different way to pay to do it. So. Yeah. But so, so do you have any kind of a regular schedule, you guys train and in review things with your clients? Or is it more of, you know, year end as needed during the year? With how frequently are you in touch with your, your clients? And I’m assuming that varies based on what they’re doing, but just kind of a general rule.
Catherine Tindall 9:06
Yeah, for the most part, you know, we like to engage with clients where they’ve got enough complexity going on where quarterly meetings make sense. You know, and it depends, because some people they’ll have years where they’re kind of in a set it and forget it year, they’re not doing any deals, it’s all very, you know, run of the mill. Other times, you know, you can hit like during COVID. You know, we had a lot of people that were doing a lot of deals quickly to take advantage of hot markets and everything and, you know, so it just depends on what people have going on. But I think kind of the thing that you mentioned with the the difference between like the the tax professional, who, you know, they’re just trying to meet a filing requirement and make sure that you’re staying, you’re meeting your obligations with the IRS, and that’s a good thing. Like, I don’t knock that, you know, that’s what we do too. But with real estate, it’s just so much more fun because you’ve got all these chess pieces to play with. And it’s almost more like a game and you can really strategize around it by doing stuff like those cost segregation studies, or accelerating depreciation and other ways and taking advantage of like different entity structures and things like that. So I think that’s just what it makes it more fun for the investor. And it’s a lot more fun for the tax professional. And that’s more kind of the relationship of the chess game.
J Darrin Gross 10:24
I’m just gonna say fun. And taxes don’t always say, same conversation or the same sentence, but but having fun planning to take advantage of some of the opportunities or you know, what you can do to minimize your tax? Makes sense? So, the, the ideal, kind of a situation for your client? I mean, do you have clients that are kind of just starting out? Do you have clients that are? Are, you know, seasoned? Where do you? Where do you range on that
Catherine Tindall 11:00
A lot of the people that we encounter, they’re kind of a mix. So we’ve got, we get some that are fairly well seasoned, they’ve kind of leveled up out of their existing relationship they need, you know, they have more moving pieces, they have more wealth they’re trying to protect, but we also get a lot of people where they started out in say, like a high earning W2 job, have realized how much they were losing in tax just or earning their income that way, wanted to shift more into real estate, and then are now transitioning to like, that’s how they’re building out their wealth. And we also get a mix of people to where they start off, maybe having a closely held business that they run, where they’re self employed, but then they want to transition to more passive wealth building through growing the real estate portfolio, and it’s just a, it’s a, if you have a taste for it, and a knack for it, it’s just a wonderful strategy to build wealth, you know, really tax efficiently. And so that’s kind of the range of, of people that we’ve that we serve.
J Darrin Gross 12:00
I’m curious, you know, you mentioned high high income or a W2 employee. Somebody that’s not invested in real estate in that kind of situation, versus having, you know, changed or gotten into real estate, and been able to take advantage of some of the, the, you know, the tax advantages of real estate offers it, can you give kind of a an estimate as to what you would expect their tax. I mean, I guess, their net tax rate to change from two, if there’s that, too.
Catherine Tindall 12:40
But I’ve know, I’ve seen people go from being over 50% to 20%. You know, just by because it all depends on the character of how you earn your income, right. So for people who are on a W2, every dollar that you earned from your employer, you’re going to have a certain amount of that that’s going to get taxed with payroll taxes. And then on top of that, you’re also going to have it all come in at your ordinary income bracket rates, right.
So those scale up really quickly, it’s really easy to all of a sudden you find yourself in a 30 something percent tax bracket rate. And then on the state side, if you’re in a high income tax state, you know, like, if you’re in New York, or California or any of those places, you can be well over 50% Just through having a W two job versus if you can switch it to the real estate, you can drop that down significantly because you can take advantage of things like depreciation that produce kind of a, you know, a paper loss, but you’re still getting a positive cash flow. And the nice thing with real estate is you can you can time how you’re earning your income, you know, you have a lot of control over when you’re going to do deals, you have a lot of control over you know, the character of the properties that you’re picking up as part of your portfolio and what you’re doing with them and, and how you’re making the investments. And if you’re going to make improvements to them, you know, you kind of have all the pieces so you can you can really strategize how much income you’re earning, and each year based on what you have going on versus if you’re an employee, you know, it’s you really don’t have any control on how that money’s, you know, going to come in and get taxed, because it’s that’s just how the tax codes written for employees.
J Darrin Gross 14:24
Yeah, no, the control you mentioned, I hadn’t thought about that. But I guess the option if you if you wanted to postpone the sale till next year, as opposed to close it before the end of the year, to give you some additional time to plan if you need to. It makes a lot of sense. You know, one of the things you didn’t mention and just kind of curious what your thoughts are on 1031 Exchange, as an option to defer the tax from deal to deal What are your thoughts on that?
Catherine Tindall 15:03
Oh, it’s wonderful strategy. You know, and it’s, I think it’s one of those things. Sometimes it’s worth it to pay the tax, it depends on your liquidity needs. But if you’re in the long game, it’s a very good strategy. And basically a little background for anyone who’s not familiar with the 1031 exchange, it’s a specialty area, it’s a, it’s a specialty section of the tax code, which allows you to, you know, you have to follow a lot of rules, and you have to use a Qualified Intermediary. So you can’t just, you know, DIY it, it’s something that you do have to have professionals involved with, and it has to be executed a certain way. But the basic benefit of it is you can take property, sell that property, exchange it into a like kind property, and not have to realize the capital gains on the appreciation from that property that you had bought. And so you kind of push everything into that new property. And then you’re able to, you can continue to do this over and over. So as you have properties that are appreciating, or you want to, you know, change geographic locations of where you have your portfolio or, you know, any number of things, it’s a fairly flexible vehicle for you to be able to keep, you know, growing your wealth, and, you know, realizing those appreciations without having to trigger income tax that’s, you know, going to really, you know, eat quite a chunk out of the principle that you you have, you know, you’ve grown in those properties.
J Darrin Gross 16:35
Yeah, no, I, it’s funny, because I’ve always had kind of a longer view of investing, and always thought the goal was to build a big enough, you know, nest egg or machine that would continue to create revenue to where it wouldn’t erode the principle, which a lot of times when I look at, like a 401k, I mean, basically, it’s a savings plan. And they’re the, you know, the idea is to get you just about a day passed, you die. To zero, it’s not there’s no, you know, it’s not really a plan to, to get beyond that, or at least that’s not really intent, I think, you know, they answer tax, period. But on the on the 1031, I had run into some people that were like, they were like, I don’t really believe in that. And I was like, Well, I don’t understand. But it occurred to me that if you’re, if you’re, basically you’re getting in and getting out basically flipping properties, whether it be, you know, single family or, or multi, multi family properties, or what have you, and you’re only in it for a year or two, and you’re out, you know, out, out slow enough to take advantage of the capital gains, tax rate, but fast enough that you don’t really have a whole lot of depreciation. You know, built up I was gonna, I guess it does, I can see how it’s not as advantageous for somebody that’s in and out of something right away. But if you’ve been in something, and you’ve used up, you know, as a 27, and a half years of depreciation on residential and 39, on commercial commercial, yep. So if you’ve, if you’ve used up a large percentage of your, your depreciation, and the property is appreciated, that can be a pretty significant, I guess, it’s not all tax, but just the I mean, it seems like you, you’re eating up a lot of that, that you could reinvest into the next deal. Yeah, and, you know, continue to collaborate, your, your leverage your, your equity, to then get into a larger and more profitable robbery. But anyway, it was definitely an eye opener for me to see somebody that was like anti that and to kind of understand that, do you have any kind of a sense of number of years? Or where do you look? Is there other time horizon where you recognize that a 1031, may or may not be appropriate?
Catherine Tindall 19:05
You know, it just depends too, on the rest of what they have going on in their portfolio, and what’s going on in the rest of their income, kind of tax life, because for some people, you know, if it’s, they’re just doing one deal, it’s a smaller deal, and they haven’t been in the property for very long, you know, it’s not that much of a hit to pick up the capital gains on it, because it’s certain, you know, bracket rates, you can take advantage of, there’s a certain bucket that fills up at 0%, there’s a certain bucket, you know, that’s 15. And so it’s more just comes down to the, you know, the overall timing for the person. And I think the other consideration to that you have is, you know, there’s a big difference between people who are in real estate where the property is considered an investment versus when the property is considered inventory. And so when it’s considered ordinary income and You know, if they’re doing fix and flips, and it’s really that kind of operation that gets treated differently than say someone who invests in a multifamily is planning on having it for, you know, 1015 years, they’re just going to rent it, maybe they’re going to put improvements in it, you know, strategic strategically to get some more depreciation on yours, when they have high income from other places, or whatever the case may be. So it is highly individualistic when it when it’s a good idea to do it. But I think that’s the key with a lot of the tax strategies is it’s really highly dependent on what your goals are, and what you have going on. And really taking the time to crunch the numbers to figure out if it’s going to be advantageous, and just knowing the full exposure and the full cost of doing different moves.
J Darrin Gross 20:49
Yeah, I know, and even just another thing that I was thinking over just kind of, as you mentioned, you know, the timing, and that I know, my mom’s retired and like, there was a farm sale a year or two ago or whatever, and just but how that that sale, I mean, it spiked your income for that one year, and how that then had like, not not huge effects. But as he was commenting on how the the, like Social Security going forward is reduced, because they recognize he had a significant, you know, income event kind of thing. And, but just across the board of all of you know, all of your income sources, or however you’re counting for your, you know, just to really have a strategy, as opposed to a surprise and finance give a big tax bill when you weren’t anticipating that’s, you know, you know, surprises aren’t good, I guess. No surprises. No, don’t want surprises.
Catherine Tindall 21:49
Yeah. I think a big one I see too, with a lot of people, especially probably for like your mom’s scenario is if you have any kind of subsidized health insurance, or anything like that going on, you can very easily disqualify yourself from government programs by just not, you know, not having the income smoothed out over the course of, you know, a couple of years instead of just having an all in one year. So you can, there can be a lot of surprises that pop up when you have, you know, an unusual income year.
J Darrin Gross 22:21
No, well, I didn’t get a just an eye opener to me, because I had we I was focused on all these other aspects for it and didn’t realize all the related potential complications that that, you know, that came about killing but but all survivable, but just more of a, you know, what you expected versus what you got kind of thing. So. So, I did want to just ask you, briefly, there, there’s talk about some of the the tax changes, any kind of a sense of what you think might happen with with Congress. I mean, this is we’re recording this in December 2021. Congress hasn’t exactly really been a, a real productive place. But there’s always a talk of, of change. And I think that the talk a lot of times kind of wears people out. before it actually happens. Do you have any sense of any any of the topics on on the table as far as what might happen or?
Catherine Tindall 23:35
Well, so currently, the legend, you know, this is recorded, you know, early December, so, obviously, that they they’re set to be voting on it around Christmas time, it might get pushed out to January, it’s been tough, because we’ve been, basically, they were supposed to originally have all this wrapped up back in September. So it’s a snail’s pace. And the thing that’s a little difficult with it, too, is a lot of the provisions that are in there, and that were originally proposed things keep changing. The reason for that is, the way that this legislation is getting passed is through a budget reconciliation. So it’s not just straight tax legislation. It’s all part of reconciling their budget. And so in order for them to be able to pass it, they have to have certain meet certain requirements for the dollar amounts of everything. And that’s why it’s making it so volatile. As far as you know, 1031 exchanges were on the chopping block, and now they’re not, you know, there was a lot of talk about increasing the capital gains rate for people earning over $400,000. And now that’s gone. There’s just a lot of pieces that keep coming in and out. But I think the main thing that people should take away from tax reform is that to keep a close eye on it, it’s hard to predict if it’s going to be retroactive or not. And And to just if you have that have a good relationship with your CPA. I know for us in our practice, once we get the actual final legislation of what’s happened, we’re going to go back through our database and see who’s getting impacted and reach out and make sure that we’re all we’ve done as much as we can to mitigate those negative effects from it. If it does get passed, and that’s that’s the hard thing to predict as well, because there is a lot of dissent in among the Democrats, who it’s really the Democrats who are going to be passing it amongst themselves. And there’s a lot of dissent internally in the party. And so that makes it hard to predict whether or not it will even pass in the first place. Not even knowing you know, what, specifically, they’re going to end up deciding on keeping or scrapping because, as of, you know, the night before, they can change, pretty significant provisions in the attempt to get it passed. So but I think a lot of these kinds of things like the 1031 exchanges, coming under fire, the capital gains rates, increasing a lot of talk around, getting rid of step up in basis, which is basically, you know, when you pass away, your properties get kind of marked up to fair market value, so that if your next of kin sell the property, it’s not like they have to pay capital gains on that, that piece of property the same way that they would, you know, if you were to sell it before he passed, so that was under fire, too. And so I think the main thing for people to keep in mind with a lot of those is that these are things that, you know, this particular party’s looking at. And so as long as they continue to be in power, I think a lot of these areas are going to be continued areas of interests, a lot of those kinds of motifs in the tax code and reform change, or things that have been around since, you know, the Obama administration. So just knowing that this is kind of in the mind of, you know, this party, and as long as they’re maintaining control, that these are things that might continue to come up and might continue to be areas of interest, I think is important for people to know.
J Darrin Gross 27:05
Question for you. You mentioned retroactive. Is there a point at which they go past where they would not make it retroactive? I mean, if they don’t vote on this until January? Is that? Would that like, they said, Okay, no, we’ll make it effective this year going forward? Or is it just there, they’re able to do whatever, it just seems kind of, you know, double whammy, if you think your past and then yeah, you know, I mean, even filed taxes yet for the year, but still, it’d be nice to be able to plan. Is there any kind of a line that they follow, as far as you know, when they will not make it retroactive?
Catherine Tindall 27:47
You know, there’s, there’s Supreme Court precedents for Congress being able to make retroactive tax changes, which to me, just seems really insane, that you can go back. You know, it seems like it should be a right that people are allowed to plan for their taxes. And that once the time has elapsed, you know, you’re only on the hook for what was law as of when you did things. But sadly, that is not how our tax code is written. And so, you know, I think some of the original provisions it was supposed to go back to September is when the changes would be effective as a, but you know, the best hope is that they don’t do that, because there’s going to be a lot of blowback if they do. But at the same time, it’s always kind of weighted between, you know, punishing people for doing for putting in retroactive changes, but then also, if they let people have the the window to make the changes, you can cause a lot of market volatility, and other economic issues can pop up. So I think those are the two things that they weigh. But no, they’re not. I don’t think that there’s a particular statute of limitations how far they can go back, you know, specifically, but so that’s the fear that it will be, you know, retroactive in 2021 and get passed in 2022. I’m just hoping that they don’t wait so long that we have to amend a bunch of tax returns at the same time, but that’s, you know, that is on the table.
J Darrin Gross 29:18
Yeah, it just seems a I could see just you know, more challenges of where we are we already have the the other thing so talking about the retroactive the unintended consequences you mentioned like if they pass something then all there’s all sorts of market activity. You know, if if they’re, I guess if they’re if they got away or did away with a step up in basis would not putting property in a trust would that not be your you know, your vehicle I mean, if that was the new, the new move to where they say, Aha, we gotcha, we’re not gonna be the step up and basis would would that not be kind of like a just a door open for? You know, trust business? It just seems like that’s kind of one of one of the things one of the appeals about real estate.
Catherine Tindall 30:20
Yeah. And that’s, I think that’s highlights part of some of the futility and some of the tax changes, just because they’ll there’s always other ways to do things. And, you know, between estate planning and tax planning, you know, once we have kind of a new rulebook with tax reform, it just becomes now another game of how do we Okay, so here’s what we have, how do we best leverage this based on the rules we have to follow? And where, you know, are there loopholes that we can take advantage of that are in the law? You know, what are the opportunities here? And then what are the opportunities in someone’s particular situation that they can take advantage of? Like, do they have, you know, close family members that we can shift things to? Can we take advantage of things like family limited partnerships, can we take advantage of trusts and gifting strategies? And so that just becomes, you know, it just forces both, you know, the tax planner, myself and the estate planner, to reassess the situation, if we have, you know, all of a sudden, the game has a bunch of new rules in it. So that’s usually, that’s what I’m anticipating if there’s, you know, major changes that happen, it’s just, you have to kind of reassess everyone’s situation for a new new set of rules.
J Darrin Gross 31:33
New Game. Interesting. Well, it sounds like your job. Security’s pretty good. I mean, as far as, you know, I mean, what’s funny is, you know, when people have basically a W two, and no ride off kind of thing, or very little write off. It’s, it’s really a pretty vanilla kind of thing. But once you do get into real estate, and you have multiple schedules and multiple properties, and while I mean, I can imagine somebody trying to do it themselves. I know people do, but I was like, I don’t understand why you would try to do that when there’s somebody like yourself that, that, you know, studies and swimlane, and every day and knows the ins and outs and can recognize an opportunity to, to, you know, give you a chance to keep more of more of your money, rather than have to just write a check. Yeah, but anyway, Hey, Catherine, if we could, like shift gears here for a second. My day, I’m an insurance broker. And one of the things we try and do is manage risk with our clients and, and there’s a couple of strategies we look at when we’re trying to manage or do risk management, the first we look at, we look to see if there’s a way we can avoid the risk. The second if, if that’s if we can’t avoid it, we look to see if we can minimize the risk. And then if we cannot avoid or minimize the risk, we let’s see if there’s a way to transfer the risk. And that’s what a insurance policy is. And I like to ask my guests, if they can look at their own situation. It could be your clients, you know, interest rates, it could be the legal claimant potential tax law changes, however, you’d like to frame the question. But I’d like to ask you, you know, what do you consider to be the biggest risk? And for clarification, again, while I am an insurance broker, I’m not necessarily looking for an insurance related answer. And so if you’re willing, I’d like to ask you, Catherine Tindall. What is the BIGGEST RISK?
Catherine Tindall 33:53
I say, you know, the BIGGEST RISK that I see, just from my professional perspective of the kind of cases that I diagnose and deal with on a day to day basis, the the main area of loss I see for people is that they, they do a set it and forget it strategy when it comes to dealing with their tax situation. And a lot of people because it’s so technical, they don’t have a way of assessing whether or not they’re doing everything that they can unless they’re going to take the time to learn how to do it themselves. And so I’d say for most people who get involved in real estate or who get, you know, start having a lot more going on economically, that it’s, it’s worth it to take the time to reassess your situation, get a second set of eyes, to make sure that you’re not missing out on things because it can be 20 to 50% of your yearly effort. You’re kind of working for the government, right if that’s how you deal with, you know, paying your tax. And so to just not re examine that every once in a while, you can really be losing a lot of the effort that you’re putting in just for, you know, things that are very easy to change, like just filing paperwork for splitting out entities or adding a kid to payroll or things like that. So that’s what I see is the biggest risk. And a lot of the times once, once those things are set, and times gone by sometimes we can go backwards to save the tax. But more often we can’t, it’s once it’s done, it’s done. I had someone recently where they, they tried to execute a 1031 exchange on their own. And they didn’t do it correctly. And they didn’t, they didn’t meet the timing requirements involved with it. And so they ended up with like over $200,000 in tax that could have been very easily deferred. You know, they were aware of the strategy, they had an intermediary involved, but they just didn’t execute correctly. And so I think that’s the biggest risk I see for people is, you know, to try to DIY too long, or to just set it and forget it, and not realizing that this, it’s another area of being able to really maximize your wealth is being more strategic with you know, that tax number.
J Darrin Gross 36:24
Yeah, the DIY 1031 Exchange, not an option. That’s not a good strategy. Wow, that’s too bad. But I appreciate you sharing that because it’s, it’s so true. I think, myself included like to, quote set and forget it, but forget that, you know, looking a little bit forward, you can, you can do a lot of preparation to make a better landing than crash landing. Good. Catherine, where can the listeners go if they’d like to learn more or connect with you?
Catherine Tindall 36:57
So two good places. I keep our website Dominion Enterprise Services, its dominiones.com. We have a lot of resources on there. Very often, my partner and I will post we’ll chat about tax topics, tax planning ideas. We have some tools on the website for you know, assessing eligibility for credits, things like that. But another good place to connect is on LinkedIn. I’m fairly active on there and post, you know, updates with what’s going on with tax reform and different thoughts that I have in situations that I encounter and planning ideas and those sorts of things. So those two places are the best to get connected.
J Darrin Gross 37:37
Got it. Catherine, I want to say thanks for taking the time to talk today. I’ve enjoyed our talk. I learned a lot. And I look forward to doing it again soon.
Catherine Tindall 37:50
Yeah, thank you so much, Darrin, it was an absolute pleasure.
J Darrin Gross 37:54
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